Sam Wight :verified:: “Fucking Christ the @protocol i…” - Urbanists.Social

Incredible critique of the protocol Bluesky is creating. It sounds like s shitshow.

So the news is telling me, Bluesky is the hottest new decentralized thing, with parole waiting month to join, or buying invite codes of ebay, for thousands of dollars.

Yet there’s not one other instance out there, for people to join this decentralized paradise. Idk, just sounds a little sussy to me.

I know there was stems.social, but when people tried joining it, they cried “abuse” and shut it down - so no, it doesn’t count.

I get that there are groups of people who don’t have many good options besides Bluesky, so moistly this is griping about how bad social media is generally, and how the lousy people in charge continue to be in charge.

an interesting observation in a post twitter reality is how services that are sprouting up to claim some of the refugees are setting themselves up as closed gardens. without the option to federate with other services. like spoutable, counter.social, post, clubhouse and such.

@xuu@txt.sour.is @prologic@twtxt.net Yarn.social without threading (as it would be the case in a “truncated” feed) does not make sense to me.

Put another way: Yarn.social is not twtxt. The content that we all have in our feeds really is much closer to a web forum or usenet or whatever. It’s threaded conversations. twtxt, as I believe it was originally intended, are short little status updates – that’s it. The formats of Yarn.social and twtxt might be very similar, but the content is vastly different and, in a way, incompatible. (As such, I think I understand very well that the original twtxt crowd is disgruntled.)

That proposed truncated feed doesn’t really provide any value, if you ask me. 🤔 It’d just be chaotic.

👋 Q: How do we feel about forking the Twtxt spec into what we love and use today in Yarn.social in yarnd, tt, jenny, twtr and other clients? 🤔 Thinking about (and talking with @xuu@txt.sour.is on IRC) about the possibility of rewriting a completely new spec (no extensions). Proposed name yarn.txt or “Yarn”. Compatibility would remain with Twtxt in the sense that we wouldn’t break anything per se, but we’d divorce ourselves from Twtxt and be free to improve based on the needs of the community and not the ideals of those that don’t use, contribute in the first place or fixate on nostalgia (which doesn’t really help anyone).

💡 Quick ‘n Dirty prototype Yarn.social protocol/spec:

If we were to decide to write a new spec/protocol, what would it look like?

Here’s my rough draft (back of paper napkin idea):

• Feeds are JSON file(s) fetchable by standard HTTP clients over TLS
  
• WebFinger is used at the root of a user’s domain (or multi-user) lookup. e.g: prologic@mills.io -> https://yarn.mills.io/~prologic.json
  
• Feeds contain similar metadata that we’re familiar with: Nick, Avatar, Description, etc
  
• Feed items are signed with a ED25519 private key. That is all “posts” are cryptographically signed.
  
• Feed items continue to use content-addressing, but use the full Blake2b Base64 encoded hash.
  
• Edited feed items produce an “Edited” item so that clients can easily follow Edits.
  
• Deleted feed items produced a “Deleted” item so that clients can easily delete cached items.
  

#Yarn.social #Protocol #Ideas

so in effect it would look something like this:

---
subject: acct:me@sour.is
aliases:
  - salty:me@sour.is
  - yarn:xuu@ev.sour.is
  - status:xuu@chaos.social
  - mailto:me@sour.is
---
subject: salty:me@sour.is
aliases:
  - acct:me@sour.is
links:
  - rel:    self
    type:   application/json+salty
    href:   https://ev.sour.is/inbox/01GAEMKXYJ4857JQP1MJGD61Z5
    properties:
        "http://salty.im/ns/nick":    xuu
        "http://salty.im/ns/display": Jon Lundy
        "http://salty.im/ns/pubkey":     kex140fwaena9t0mrgnjeare5zuknmmvl0vc7agqy5yr938vusxfh9ys34vd2p
---
subject: yarn:xuu@ev.sour.is
links:
  - rel: https://txt.sour.is/user/xuu
    properties:
        "https://sour.is/rel/redirect": https://txt.sour.is/.well-known/webfinger?resource=acct%3Axuu%40txt.sour.is
---    
subject: status:xuu@chaos.social
links:
   - rel: http://joinmastodon.org#xuu%40chaos.social
     properties:
        "https://sour.is/rel/redirect": https://chaos.social/.well-known/webfinger?resource=acct%3Axuu%40chaos.social
---
subject: mailto:me@sour.is
...

@xuu@txt.sour.is that doesn’t seem to fit the spirit of the spec, at least by my read (I could be wrong obv). The example on Wikipedia’s webfinger page,

{
	"subject": "acct:bob@example.com",
	"aliases": [
		"https://www.example.com/~bob/"
	],
	"properties": {
		"http://example.com/ns/role": "employee"
	},
	"links": [{
			"rel": "http://webfinger.example/rel/profile-page",
			"href": "https://www.example.com/~bob/"
		},
		{
			"rel": "http://webfinger.example/rel/businesscard",
			"href": "https://www.example.com/~bob/bob.vcf"
		}
	]
}

and then the comparison with how mastodon uses webfinger,

{
    "subject": "acct:Mastodon@mastodon.social",
    "aliases": [
        "https://mastodon.social/@Mastodon",
        "https://mastodon.social/users/Mastodon"
    ],
    "links": [
        {
            "rel": "http://webfinger.net/rel/profile-page",
            "type": "text/html",
            "href": "https://mastodon.social/@Mastodon"
        },
        {
            "rel": "self",
            "type": "application/activity+json",
            "href": "https://mastodon.social/users/Mastodon"
        },
        {
            "rel": "http://ostatus.org/schema/1.0/subscribe",
            "template": "https://mastodon.social/authorize_interaction?uri={uri}"
        }
    ]
}

suggests to me you want to leave the subject/acct bit as is (don’t add prefixes) and put extra information you care to include in the links section, where you’re free to define the rel URIs however you see fit. The notion here is that webfinger is offering a mapping from an account name to additional information about that account, so if anything you’d use a "subject": "acct:SALTY ACCOUNT_REPRESENTATION" line in the JSON to achieve what you’re saying if you don’t want to do that via links.

@prologic@twtxt.net That was exactly my thought at first too. but what do we put as the rel for salty account? since it is decentralized we dont have a set URL for machines to key off. so for example take the standard response from okta:

# http GET https://example.okta.com/.well-known/webfinger  resource==acct:bob
{
    "links": [
        {
            "href": "https://example.okta.com/sso/idps/OKTA?login_hint=bob#",
            "properties": {
                "okta:idp:type": "OKTA"
            },
            "rel": "http://openid.net/specs/connect/1.0/issuer",
            "titles": {
                "und": "example"
            }
        }
    ],
    "subject": "acct:bob"
}

It gives one link that follows the OpenID login. So the details are specific to the subject acct:bob.

Mastodons response:

{
  "subject": "acct:xuu@chaos.social",
  "aliases": [
    "https://chaos.social/@xuu",
    "https://chaos.social/users/xuu"
  ],
  "links": [
    {
      "rel": "http://webfinger.net/rel/profile-page",
      "type": "text/html",
      "href": "https://chaos.social/@xuu"
    },
    {
      "rel": "self",
      "type": "application/activity+json",
      "href": "https://chaos.social/users/xuu"
    },
    {
      "rel": "http://ostatus.org/schema/1.0/subscribe"
    }
  ]
}

it supplies a profile page and a self which are both specific to that account.

Trying to wrap my head around webfinger..

my first thoughts about it were that a subject of acct:me@sour.is would have a listing of rel’s for the different accounts that are related to me (ie. yarn, salty, twitter, mastodon, etc…)

but maybe my thinking is at the wrong level.. that each of those accounts would be on a subject level and the rels are describing different aspects of that account. so i would have salty:acct:xuu@sour.is, twitter:acct:xuu, mastodon:acct:xuu@chaos.social, yarn:acct:xuu@ev.sour.is and then i could have a main acct:me@sour.is that links them together as aliases.

I found okta will do something similar with its accounts to show as okta:acct:user@domain so maybe I am on to something?

I think boredom is a real force that pushes ourselves to the edge, to hopefully make a change in life, like going out to see real people. Social media creates this cozy, safe place to keep your mind occupied, letting life pass without realizing it. Social media may prevent users from reaping creative rewards of profound boredom | Hacker News

social.encryptomatic.com:70

Twitter has a new “social platforms” policy… is it maddening? Hilarious? Ridiculous? All of the above? I laughed, but to be clear, I don’t think ‘funny’ is a good way to describe it.

Desafortunadamente este año he reflexionado mucho sobre el papel de consumismo en la sociedad. Vivimos para tener dinero para poder comprar las cosas, aunque ya no hay propósitos más profundos.

Las relaciones sociales se limitan a consumir, cómo en los centros comerciales, o en las reuniones decembrinas.

En mi familia en lugar del intercambio de amigo secreto, se limitó a “Dame 10 dólares, ya no te preocupes por buscarme un regalo”, especialmente en generaciones más jóvenes, lo que es todavía peor, ni si quiera hay ese enlace emocional por haberte comprado algo.

¿Que se puede hacer? Desafortunadamente va por romper formas modernas de vivir e ir contra la mayoría. Permitirse desconectar de lo que eres, de lo que posees.

Desafortunadamente este año he reflexionado mucho sobre el papel de consumismo en la sociedad. Vivimos para tener dinero para poder comprar las cosas, aunque ya no hay propósitos más profundos.

Las relaciones sociales se limitan a consumir, cómo en los centros comerciales, o en las reuniones decembrinas.

En mi familia en lugar del intercambio de amigo secreto, se limitó a “Dame 10 dólares, ya no te preocupes por buscarme un regalo”, especialmente en generaciones más jóvenes, lo que es todavía peor, ni si quiera hay ese enlace emocional por haberte comprado algo.

¿Que se puede hacer? Desafortunadamente va por romper formas modernas de vivir e ir contra la mayoría. Permitirse desconectar de lo que eres, de lo que posees.

Social media should be forbidden before 18.

PSA: DMs on social media sites are not truely PMs. This is why we have a separate tool for private messaging from yarn. Always remember, if you don’t own the infra (or the parts at the ends of e2e encryption) you don’t own the data. and the true owners can view it any way they want!

https://twitter.com/TinkerSec/status/1587040089057759235?t=At-8r9yJPiG6xF17skTxwA&s=19

@tkanos@twtxt.net user in question had posted information about someones employment in what appeared to be a threat to contact their boss. Maybe it was in jest.. but we felt it was a form of doxing that we do not wish to see within our community. Yarn.Social is first and foremost a town square of ideas and should be viewed as a safe place for all.

@jlj@twt.nfld.uk @xuu@txt.sour.is hello! @prologic@twtxt.net and I were chatting about the question of globally deleting twts from the yarn.social network. @prologic@twtxt.net noted that he could build the tools and endpoints to delete twts, but some amount of cooperation from pod operators would be necessary to make it all work together. He asked me to spawn a discussion of the subject here, so here we are!

I don’t have enough technical knowledge of yarn.social to say with any credibility how it all should work, but I can say that I think it ought to be possible and it’d be good to do for those rare times when it’s needed.

Ahora estoy pensando en hacer una versión como Progressive Web App, aunque ahora este twtxt es más como un log. Me gustaría ver si desde Web podríamos hacer una interfaz más social (en el espíritu de microblogging cómo Twitter)

@abucci@anthony.buc.ci Do you happen to use Signal btw? 🤔 If you do, it would be great if you could join the Yarn.social Signal Group (_at least until we have Group support and better apps for Salty.im 😅)

Huh… Nope.

HTTP/1.1 200 OK
Content-Length: 407
Content-Type: text/calendar
Access-Control-Allow-Origin: *
Access-Control-Expose-Headers: ETag
Permissions-Policy: interest-cohort=()
Content-Security-Policy: default-src 'none'; sandbox
Referrer-Policy: same-origin
Vary: Authorization


BEGIN:VCALENDAR
VERSION:2.0;2.0
PRODID:SandCal
CALSCALE:GREGORIAN
BEGIN:VEVENT
DTSTAMP:20220822T180903Z
UID:bb63bfbd-623e-4805-b11b-3181d96375e6
DTSTART;TZID=America/Chicago:20220827T000000
CREATED:20220822T180903Z
LAST-MODIFIED:20220822T180903Z
LOCATION:https://meet.jit.si/Yarn.social
SUMMARY:Yarn Call
RRULE:FREQ=WEEKLY
DTEND;TZID=America/Chicago:20220827T010000
END:VEVENT
END:VCALENDAR

👋 Hello @burglar@txt.sour.is, welcome to txt.sour.is, a Yarn.social Pod! To get started you may want to check out the pod’s Discover feed to find users to follow and interact with. To follow new users, use the ⨁ Follow button on their profile page or use the Follow form and enter a Twtxt URL. You may also find other feeds of interest via Feeds. Welcome! 🤗

We’ve barreled past the microblog line and flew straight over the e-mail chain line. This is just social blogging.

The problem I have with the vast majority of social movements, left or right, is that they often lead to projection instead of introspection. Instead of person A trying to decide how person B can treat person C better, person A should try to decide how person A can treat person C better.

@chronolink@chrono.tilde.cafe Replies are not part of the original twtxt format. They were added later as an extension by Yarn.social: https://dev.twtxt.net/doc/twtsubjectextension.html (only the section “Machine-Parsable Conversation Grouping” is used these days)

It’ll track a bunch of finger(1) endpoints and let you see what’s new. Very early draft. Not actually a social network, more an anti-social network for ‘80s CompSci transplants. :-)

A read-only, finger(1)-based social network, maybe? http://txtpunk.com/fingers/

We don’t have meaningful social connections anymore like our parents or their parents geeration had. We are so scattered, that I am unsure how many of my friends are actually friends and how many are just professional contacts. Everytime I switch job, almost 70% of my friends suddenly fall out of contact. Heck, I don’t even know the people who live in next apartments both left, right, up and down on the same building. Socializing with my friends mean, setting up an appointment weeks ahead to see if we can align on a free-slot and this often involves all of us commuting to somewhere and disbanding by 22:00 hours because family, work next morning, chores to do, doctor appointment and other human things. Why do you waste so much time on the internet? | Hacker News

I don’t use social media anymore, mostly for privacy reasons, but one of the things I miss about it is being able to interact directly with creators I enjoy.

Elon Musk Offers To Buy Twitter For $41 Billion
Billionaire Elon Musk has offered to buy Twitter for about $41 billion, just days after rejecting a seat on the social media company’s board. From a report: Musk’s offer price of $54.20 per share, which was disclosedin a regulatory filing on Thursday, represents a 38% premium to Twitter’s April 1 close, the last trading day before the Tesla CEO’s more than 9% stake in the company … ⌘ Read more

Decentralization comes at very high costs. A self-authenticating social protocol | Hacker News

The moral of this story is that secondary and tertiary effects matter. Technology not only affects what we can do with respect to technological issues, it also affects our social behavior. This social behavior can loop back and affect the original technological issues under consideration. The Lisp Curse

Lisp is so powerful that problems which are technical issues in other programming languages are social issues in Lisp. The Lisp Curse

Technical Solutions Poorly Solve Social Problems Technical Solutions Poorly Solve Social Problems - Xe

@tamer@twtxt.net We’re not trying to compete with anything… If you’ve read About Yarn.social – In a nutshell I want to create an open, transparent social platform that respect’s folks privacy and freedoms. It must also be easy to use and down-to-earth where human interactions actually matter. None of this rubbish of manipulating what you see, driving up engagement numbers to serve your advertisers and all that garbage

First rule of SSB is: be patient - it is meant to move slower than conventional social networks

James Mills - Future of Yarn.social

JavaScript : web apps

wut?! 😳 seriously?! 🤦‍♂️

Python : small tools

Okay 👌

Go: micro services

Umm bad generalization 🤣 – Example yarnd that powers most of Yarn.social 😂

Java: enterprise software

Yes! Oh gawd yes! 🤣 And Java™ needs to die a swift death!

C: crimes

Hmmm? 🤔 I feel this one is going to have some backslash and/or go the way of “Hacker” being misconstrued to mean entirely different/incorrect things as is what’s happening in the media (for various definitions of “media”).

🤔 👋 Reconsidering moving Yarn.social’s development back to Github: Speaking of which (I do not forget); @fastidious@arrakis.netbros.com and I were discussing over a video call two nights ago, as well as @lyse@lyse.isobeef.org who joined a bit later, about the the whole moved of all of my projects and their source code off of Github. Whilst some folks do understand and appreciate my utter disgust over what Microsoft and Copilot did by blatantly scraping open source software’s codebases without even so much as any attempt at attribution or respecting the licenes of many (if not all?) open source projects.

That being said however, @fastidious@arrakis.netbros.com makes a very good and valid argument for putting Yarn.social’s codebases, repositories and issues back on Github for reasons that make me “torn” over my own sense of morality and ethics.

But I can live with this as long as I continue to run and operate my new (yet to be off the ground) company “Self Hosted Pty Ltd” and where it operates it’s own code hosting, servicesa, tools, etc.

Plese comment here on your thoughts. Let us decide togetehr 🤗

#yarnsocial #github #opsnsource #copilot #microsoft

Btw… You guys have gotta start posting more pictures/videos a bit more regularly 😂 Every time I show Yarn.social off to a friend to “sell” them the platform and get them off their privacy eroding garbage Facebook/Twitter/etc) The no. #1 question I get asked is:

Oh is this only comments/text

🤣 Let’s show off the platform as a whole a bit eh? 😅

Hmmm so… We seem to have a few pods offline in the network 😂 Also 😢

• @jlj@twt.nfld.uk’s twt.nfld.uk => 504 Gateway Time-out
  
• @adi@f.adi.onl’s f.adi.onl => 200 OK but doens’t appear to be a pod anymore?! 🤔
  
• @eldersnake@yarn.andrewjvpowell.com’s personal pod => offline due to lack of Solar/Battery power? 😅
  
• @lohn@tw.lohn.in’s personal pod => 503 Service Unavailable
  

It’s a bad day for Yarn.social 🤣

Good thing it’s all decentralised 😉

An estimated 6.8 million fewer female births will be recorded across India by 2030 because of the persistent use of selective abortions, researchers estimate. — The Guardian

And from the same article:

India’s skewed ratio of men to women – currently between 900-930 females per 1,000 males – reflects India’s ingrained attitude towards girls. Boys are seen as breadwinners while girls are seen as a burden across every social class. Boys are more likely to receive more nutritious food and better medical care than girls.

That is just beyond sad.

Social Media Nightmares — https://dbohdan.com/social-media-nightmares

Pinboard describes itself as “Social bookmarking for introverts”. Maybe txtxt is social networking for introverts.

I keep going back ‘n’ forth on whether to experiment with Pleroma on my Pi. :-) A Tildes post on the sad news that Feneas is struggling has rekindled the fire, oddly. I just like knowing, first-hand, what’s involved in running these services; I feel it makes me a better yarn.social advocate. ^⨰^

maybe social networking is just terrible and bad

xn–dw9h.social is taken :-(

🧶.social